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 Post subject: Dragons...Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 12:33 am 
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So I was thinking about dragons. Many people portray dragons as evil and demonic creatures. In my world in the stories I write there are both. Good and evil dragons. I'm curious about your dragons and your view on dragons. Good, bad, or both? What are your dragons like? What are their likes, dislikes, and other characteristics?

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2015 5:47 am 
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It really all depends on which world I am using. In Lor-Amar, the different types of dragons are prone to different sins. Wyverns bend toward materialism very easily, so it is quite common to find a bad one (made worse by the size and temper of a dragon, so you really don't forget it if you meet one), but there are some who are good. Basilisks are more likely to be noble, but can still be very temperamental, and are furies when they are angered.

Some of my dragons are neither. Lyrblaka and Leviathan are powerful creatures, but lack the ethical judgments which higher dragons can process.

In other stories, I use dragons to represent evil, so of course, they have to follow that type.

It seems that when writers have strictly good dragons, they are often just fun, strong companions for riders. It would be interesting to see the mystery of dragons portrayed more often, as with Asian dragons being wise creatures.

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All resemblance to persons, people, friends, relatives, quotes, cultures, artificial intelligences, inside jokes, pets, unclaimed personalities, sentient objects, extra-terrestrials, inter-terrestrials, and draperies living, dead, undead, or comatose in any of my work are purely coincidental, incidental, circumstantial, inadvertent, unplanned, unforeseen, and unintentional. There's seriously no way I was referring to you. Honest.

The story so far:
Birthright: Eleventh chapter pending. 28280 words.
Heritage: First chapter drafted.
Legacy: Character and plot development stage.
Get a feel for the land. Visit Lor-Amar today!

Other novels on the brain:
Quicksilver
Shen'oh Story
Crusoe's Star
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Seven Arts Story
The Queen's Knave
Polarians
Exile Realms
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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 8:09 pm 
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I don't really have true fantasy dragons, but I have lizards large enough and dangerous enough to lead later on to the legends of fearsome dragons. They can't fly or breathe fire. Usually aren't much bigger than horses. So they're neither good nor evil. They just are and have no sense of right or wrong.

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2015 1:11 pm 
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:dieshappy: this is very interesting. I haven't seen dragons or giant lizards portrayed this way. Both your ways are interesting. In Meridia, there is a dragon that is portrayed as a guide. A gryphon too. They guide their riders through their journey in life and their walk with the Lord .... and then there is one that was created through a manifestation of fear. Fear took in creature form of a dragon it got so big and controlling thats what it became. In the end it was defeated. The dragon of fear was a dragon I saw in a dream.

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:29 pm 
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I have nonsentient dragons that people use for work like oxen or horses.


I also have a hydra. He eats people.

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Whatever. CARPE NOCTEM!

GUYS IMMA PUBLISHED AUTHOR *CLICK ME*
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I think "IDK ask Gael she'd know" is the story of everyone's life... :D
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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2015 9:06 am 
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This topic makes me think of an extensive discussion I had with Kaitlyn when I first joined HW. :rofl:

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2015 12:43 am 
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Discussions on dragon alignment seem to pop up every so often on HW. What was that discussion about, Bushy?

_________________
You can't spell grin without ̶gRIN
Words are my ̶bread and ̶butter.
http://unshakablegirl.com/
http://www.ravelry.com/designers/kitra-skene

Haud Retene Haud Reverte

All resemblance to persons, people, friends, relatives, quotes, cultures, artificial intelligences, inside jokes, pets, unclaimed personalities, sentient objects, extra-terrestrials, inter-terrestrials, and draperies living, dead, undead, or comatose in any of my work are purely coincidental, incidental, circumstantial, inadvertent, unplanned, unforeseen, and unintentional. There's seriously no way I was referring to you. Honest.

The story so far:
Birthright: Eleventh chapter pending. 28280 words.
Heritage: First chapter drafted.
Legacy: Character and plot development stage.
Get a feel for the land. Visit Lor-Amar today!

Other novels on the brain:
Quicksilver
Shen'oh Story
Crusoe's Star
War Blazer
Seven Arts Story
The Queen's Knave
Polarians
Exile Realms
All Librarians Are Secret Agents


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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2015 6:27 am 
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Lady Kitra Skene wrote:
Discussions on dragon alignment seem to pop up every so often on HW. What was that discussion about, Bushy?

Kaitlyn went very in depth into the history/mythology of dragons and went on to prove that not only is it perfectly viable that they could've existed as a real species, but that they aren't inherently evil, even if it is still justifiable to portray them as such. It was a fascinating discussion.

Edit: found a blog post of hers on the topic. http://therainbowinthestorm.blogspot.co ... -of-4.html

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:12 pm 
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:book: sooooo folklore cave paintings and such suggest that dragons were real and alive at one time. What do you all think? I agree that people portray dragons too much as mean man eating fire breathing witchy monsters I personally don't. I think a dragon becomes what you make them.

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:03 pm 
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Perhaps not dragons in the way people picture them now, but perhaps over-large lizards like say, dinosaurs. Some of which were believed to spit acid. Easy enough for stories about that to get exaggerated into something grander.

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 7:12 pm 
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I've read theories that parasaurolophus's cranial tube could have been used to mix explosive chemicals, similar to a bombadier beetle, allowing it to breathe fire.

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Surely God is my salvation, I will trust, and not be afraid. The Lord, the Lord, is my strength and my song, He has become my salvation. ~Isaiah 12:2

Whatever. CARPE NOCTEM!

GUYS IMMA PUBLISHED AUTHOR *CLICK ME*
Lady Kitra Skene wrote:
Hitler and flamingos will always remind me of Abi.
Kya Lightwing wrote:
I think "IDK ask Gael she'd know" is the story of everyone's life... :D
The Dark Golden Dreamer wrote:
You kill people, Gael. D: How can I not die over that?
Sometimes I wonder about the reputation I have here....:rofl:


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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 11:27 pm 
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The Tyrannosaurus Rex, having so many chambers in the skull, has also been speculated to breathe fire. That would have made Jurassic Park very different...

I really don't mind seeing dragons portrayed in their traditional, tyrannical light. I more so think people could stand to be more creative when the dragons are man's best friend. Most follow a stereotype in that regard, so it would be nice to see a broader spread in the personality, nature, and culture of good dragons. Using dragons after the fashion of Smaug is not as common anymore, and seems to be something people do with more creativity than making dragons almost entirely good, if not mischievous.

_________________
You can't spell grin without ̶gRIN
Words are my ̶bread and ̶butter.
http://unshakablegirl.com/
http://www.ravelry.com/designers/kitra-skene

Haud Retene Haud Reverte

All resemblance to persons, people, friends, relatives, quotes, cultures, artificial intelligences, inside jokes, pets, unclaimed personalities, sentient objects, extra-terrestrials, inter-terrestrials, and draperies living, dead, undead, or comatose in any of my work are purely coincidental, incidental, circumstantial, inadvertent, unplanned, unforeseen, and unintentional. There's seriously no way I was referring to you. Honest.

The story so far:
Birthright: Eleventh chapter pending. 28280 words.
Heritage: First chapter drafted.
Legacy: Character and plot development stage.
Get a feel for the land. Visit Lor-Amar today!

Other novels on the brain:
Quicksilver
Shen'oh Story
Crusoe's Star
War Blazer
Seven Arts Story
The Queen's Knave
Polarians
Exile Realms
All Librarians Are Secret Agents


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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 1:00 am 
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Smaug. ^_^ I miss sly old villain dragons....

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Surely God is my salvation, I will trust, and not be afraid. The Lord, the Lord, is my strength and my song, He has become my salvation. ~Isaiah 12:2

Whatever. CARPE NOCTEM!

GUYS IMMA PUBLISHED AUTHOR *CLICK ME*
Lady Kitra Skene wrote:
Hitler and flamingos will always remind me of Abi.
Kya Lightwing wrote:
I think "IDK ask Gael she'd know" is the story of everyone's life... :D
The Dark Golden Dreamer wrote:
You kill people, Gael. D: How can I not die over that?
Sometimes I wonder about the reputation I have here....:rofl:


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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:08 am 
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Lady Abigail Mimetes wrote:
Smaug. ^_^ I miss sly old villain dragons....


Have I got a book for you. :D

_________________
You can't spell grin without ̶gRIN
Words are my ̶bread and ̶butter.
http://unshakablegirl.com/
http://www.ravelry.com/designers/kitra-skene

Haud Retene Haud Reverte

All resemblance to persons, people, friends, relatives, quotes, cultures, artificial intelligences, inside jokes, pets, unclaimed personalities, sentient objects, extra-terrestrials, inter-terrestrials, and draperies living, dead, undead, or comatose in any of my work are purely coincidental, incidental, circumstantial, inadvertent, unplanned, unforeseen, and unintentional. There's seriously no way I was referring to you. Honest.

The story so far:
Birthright: Eleventh chapter pending. 28280 words.
Heritage: First chapter drafted.
Legacy: Character and plot development stage.
Get a feel for the land. Visit Lor-Amar today!

Other novels on the brain:
Quicksilver
Shen'oh Story
Crusoe's Star
War Blazer
Seven Arts Story
The Queen's Knave
Polarians
Exile Realms
All Librarians Are Secret Agents


Top
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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 3:27 am 
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Sly old dragons?! I've got a story (not a book yet) for that, too. xD
With these guys in it: viewtopic.php?f=13&t=9056

This is a topic that interests me a lot, but for lack of time I'll just say that my dragons above are evil for the most part, but not incapable of good. As fallen sentient creatures capable (I think) of redemption, they simply express their falleness in more powerful and passionately dragonian ways than a human or elf does.

But they are definitely cast in a bad light, in keeping with traditional treatment of dragons (Tolkien and the like (though in the East they're more good-luck creatures, if I remember correctly).
I think there is something resounding to the symbolism of dragon = being ruled by passion/greed, which we see pretty clearly in The Voyage of the Dawn Treader with Eustace, but even then the symbolism was mixed and he wasn't all bad.

Interesting discussion though, for sure.

Areth,

Ka

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:57 am 
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In my worldbuilding I've made dragons be generally good unless corrupted, but decidedly not Safe ... basically highly-intelligent forces of nature, more than mere gigantic reptiles.

I think that part of why dragons have been portrayed as evil in the past is that much of what we consider "evil" is basically "actions taken that completely ignore any consideration of morality," which also describes wild or feral animals. (See also the Garrison Keillor song "My Grandmother's Cat," with ends with the moral that "your cat should be smaller than you.") And human beings have a tendency to ascribe intelligent motivation to animals, and even inanimate objects, more often than is warranted :).

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons. ..Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 7:46 pm 
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My dragons are different, depending on what world/story I'm working in. I have one story (Rin's fault, let's be honest) in which they're sentient beings capable of both evil and good. And clumsiness. ;) So I have a nasty dragon and a dragon that's not sure what he's supposed to be like - the eating humans like a monster kind or the helpful kind. Then I have a different story in which dragons can't talk, and yet they seem to have more intuition than most animals. Maybe like a dog senses people's emotions. So, yep. *Shrugs*

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons...Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2015 3:02 am 
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Credit, I most willingly take and cherish. :cool:

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You can't spell grin without ̶gRIN
Words are my ̶bread and ̶butter.
http://unshakablegirl.com/
http://www.ravelry.com/designers/kitra-skene

Haud Retene Haud Reverte

All resemblance to persons, people, friends, relatives, quotes, cultures, artificial intelligences, inside jokes, pets, unclaimed personalities, sentient objects, extra-terrestrials, inter-terrestrials, and draperies living, dead, undead, or comatose in any of my work are purely coincidental, incidental, circumstantial, inadvertent, unplanned, unforeseen, and unintentional. There's seriously no way I was referring to you. Honest.

The story so far:
Birthright: Eleventh chapter pending. 28280 words.
Heritage: First chapter drafted.
Legacy: Character and plot development stage.
Get a feel for the land. Visit Lor-Amar today!

Other novels on the brain:
Quicksilver
Shen'oh Story
Crusoe's Star
War Blazer
Seven Arts Story
The Queen's Knave
Polarians
Exile Realms
All Librarians Are Secret Agents


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 Post subject: Re: Dragons...Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2016 11:49 pm 
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It is interesting to see what dragons and other creatures are in your stories based on your descriptions! :dieshappy:

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 Post subject: Re: Dragons...Good? Evil? Or both?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2016 1:17 am 
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Now I'm wondering what other sorts of creatures people might have that are strictly good or evil.

_________________
You can't spell grin without ̶gRIN
Words are my ̶bread and ̶butter.
http://unshakablegirl.com/
http://www.ravelry.com/designers/kitra-skene

Haud Retene Haud Reverte

All resemblance to persons, people, friends, relatives, quotes, cultures, artificial intelligences, inside jokes, pets, unclaimed personalities, sentient objects, extra-terrestrials, inter-terrestrials, and draperies living, dead, undead, or comatose in any of my work are purely coincidental, incidental, circumstantial, inadvertent, unplanned, unforeseen, and unintentional. There's seriously no way I was referring to you. Honest.

The story so far:
Birthright: Eleventh chapter pending. 28280 words.
Heritage: First chapter drafted.
Legacy: Character and plot development stage.
Get a feel for the land. Visit Lor-Amar today!

Other novels on the brain:
Quicksilver
Shen'oh Story
Crusoe's Star
War Blazer
Seven Arts Story
The Queen's Knave
Polarians
Exile Realms
All Librarians Are Secret Agents


Top
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